The Trash Can

Started by Gopher, Jan 05 09 11:44

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irish bloke

"That's because men are simple in the sense that they have strong sexual urges. It tends to over ride their better judgement sometimes. We both know a straight man will put up with a lot til he finds you, me or any woman useless. Granted I'm bisexual but I'm also a woman so I know the ins and outs, the excuses, the games, etc... so I don't have to, want to or need to put up all this typical female nonsense. Sexual urges or not I don't see why a man would put up with such fussing but they do, they will and God love 'em for doing so. "

 i dont have a dog in this fight so  the rest doesnt matter with whatever is going on inbetween you two but this is poppy cock.

please dont peddle silly negative steriotypes about men   that are based off  of the ones youve known intimately

my sexual urges never over  ride my intellect or judgement and ill drop ANY woman like hot potato over ANYTHING i  reason to be even mildy annoying

DDD

God is great, beer is good and people are crazy!

irish bloke

DDD wrote:
<DIV>LOL........</DIV>

Why am i not suprised an alchoholic illiterate couldn\'t add anything to    this  discussion besides an exclamation fitting of a rather simple minded ,borish teenage girl? :D

Whats the matter? expend too much mental energy trying to sloppily convince another woman to go to Vegas with you or did i just use too many big words for your liking? ;D

Little Fish

 Lol was also my first thought on a response Irish, particularly after  fully reading your diatribe. Bloke, I reconsidered and thought silence  more befitting. For this simple truth is this, you are correct, you hit the nail  rather squarely on the head. If and when I decide to go after a woman, I  will be using the head on my shoulders, not the one between my legs.
 
 I have never been controlled by my loins or by my lust. Nor have I ever  lost or failed to maintain full control of myself and my emotions. The  only times, I have not been in control, was when I willingly submitted  myself to my lady and any one who knows what it is like to be truly  submissive to someone that takes great trust and a strong relationship.  It is not for everyone, most people rarely build a in-depth  relationship, to many build a front and rarely ever let some one behind  the masks they wear.

If I feel a woman is being abusive, dishonest or manipulative I will end the relationship and with out further adieu I would  leave. I have done so before and probably will again in the future. Woman have most of the control but only so much as we men are willing to grant them. A relationship is a two way street after all. One must give and one must be willing to receive. If a relationship is all one way it is not a relationship.

Just my two cent s on this subject. I still Loled.




 

irish bloke

Thank you little fish and  very well put !  ;D

Natasha

Little Fish wrote:
Lol was also my first thought on a response Irish, particularly after  fully reading your diatribe.

 I'll respond to you but wont even attempt to read anything "bloke" has to post. The only reason I'm noting this to you is because if my reply doesn't make sense, well you have an idea as to why.

 I reconsidered and thought silence  more befitting.

 More people should do that. Thank you for setting an example for us   :)

 For this simple truth is this, you are correct, you hit the nail  rather squarely on the head. If and when I decide to go after a woman, I  will be using the head on my shoulders, not the one between my legs.

 And what attracts you to that woman to begin with? Her elbows? Not hardly. Physical attraction a contributing factor in many things. Even who we talk to. It's part of the reason obese people think they're discriminated against. Hardly no one is up there ass.. making eyes, flirting and so on with them. People would help a thin beautiful woman before an obese ugly woman. But yeah, I'm suppose to believe hormones have nothing to do with it? Hell even in another thread someone discussed what type of woman should/shouldn't wear thongs. That comment wasn't based on sexual desier either, was it? And yes some men will put up with a bitchy woman simply because she's hot and/or because she's good in bed. I've had men admit this to me before. Notice I said SOME men. I'm not going to discriminate an entire gender based on some men. If you aren't that type of man, I'm proud of you for that part. Sadly, even when some men choose lead with their heart they can still be a mean disrepecting dick when it comes to verbalising emotions and/or thoughts. Which makes me ask you, ORIK.. does it matter if a man chooses a woman with his mind if he's disresptful toward her in many other ways? Seems to me like one trait simply cancels out another. Anyway, that saying "there are the girls you take home then there are the girls you take home to mama" is floating around for some reason.

 

I have never been controlled by my loins or by my lust. Nor have I ever  lost or failed to maintain full control of myself and my emotions. The  only times, I have not been in control, was when I willingly submitted  myself to my lady and any one who knows what it is like to be truly  submissive to someone that takes great trust and a strong relationship.  It is not for everyone, most people rarely build a in-depth  relationship, to many build a front and rarely ever let some one behind  the masks they wear.

If I feel a woman is being abusive, dishonest or manipulative I will end the relationship and with out further adieu I would  leave. I have done so before and probably will again in the future. Woman have most of the control but only so much as we men are willing to grant them.

 Not true. Women have control until she has sex with a man. Then sex plays a part in who has control. If the woman is the better of the two in bed or is the mother of his child, she will have more control. If he's better in bed, he can have more control. Well that and if he's abusive to her. But that's a horrible way to get control. Anyway there are always execptions to everything. Bringing two people together is always difficult be it employer/employee, friends, relationship.

 One must give and one must be willing to receive.

 Ok I had to snicker at that. It just sounds a little naughty.

  If a relationship is all one way it is not a relationship.

 Yes sir and neither is a friendship.

Just my two cent s on this subject.

 And your two cents are always welcomed hun  :)







 

Little Fish

ORIK.. does it matter if a man chooses a woman with his mind if  he's disrespectful toward her in many other ways? Seems to me like one  trait simply cancels out another.

Any man who is disrespectful to a woman is not a Gentleman. I was raised as a gentleman when in the company or presence of a woman I mind my manners and will be a gentleman. When I am with the guys I will let loose a bit. If a woman is present I will be mindful of my language and my manners once more.  

Men will often talk about women amongst themselves, they will often lie and brag amongst themselves, the most common thing talked of is normally the opposite sex. men talk about  having been with or wanting to be with a certain woman.

Not all men will brag or tell tales of conquests had but most will. Men are seldom entirely respectful when talking about women amongst themselves. Most men will show respect to a woman, when with a woman. However when that same man is with the guys, it is all to often a different story.

When men are amongst themselves the guys talk abut wanting to take her home and ride her wild side.  I have yet to know any men to be completely respectful to a woman unless those men are in a social gathering, or if they are in the same church or if they are related to each other.

The simple truth is this Tasha any-man who is disrespectful to a woman is not a man worth knowing or hanging around with.

I will continue to try and be a gentleman. I must admit this is not always possible. It is not always easy to be a gentleman but it is the way I was raised. Besides it is the right thing to do.  

Tasha, Any man who treats you with disrespect is not a man for you.. It is not that one trait cancels out another the question is this....

Do All the traits balance each other out?

You need to measure all of him and not just a part of him...

 

Natasha

Little Fish wrote:

Any man who is disrespectful to a woman is not a Gentleman.


 Very true. Although this logic is hard to keep in mind and apply when strong emotions are involved.

 I was raised as a gentleman when in the company or presence of a woman I mind my manners and will be a gentleman.

 That's very kind of you. You have no idea how appreciated this is to a woman. Sadly some women won't praise a man for the things he does or behavior he displays.

  When I am with the guys I will let loose a bit. If a woman is present I will be mindful of my language and my manners once more.  
Men will often talk about women amongst themselves, they will often lie and brag amongst themselves, the most common thing talked of is normally the opposite sex. men talk about  having been with or wanting to be with a certain woman.
Not all men will brag or tell tales of conquests had but most will. Men are seldom entirely respectful when talking about women amongst themselves. Most men will show respect to a woman, when with a woman. However when that same man is with the guys, it is all to often a different story.
When men are amongst themselves the guys talk abut wanting to take her home and ride her wild side.  I have yet to know any men to be completely respectful to a woman unless those men are in a social gathering, or if they are in the same church or if they are related to each other.


 None of this is surprising to me. I have 7 brothers (I'm the only girl). I'm very aware of how men talk of women. Even their own woman (when she isn't around..lol). I'm not bothered by it. In fact, it was a bit of learning experience. Just as men go on about women, women go on about men. Some women are just a little more foul mouthed about it. Perhaps it shouldn't be about men and/or/vs women but rather person to person.
The simple truth is this Tasha any-man who is disrespectful to a woman is not a man worth knowing or hanging around with.
I will continue to try and be a gentleman. I must admit this is not always possible.


 Understandable. "Always" is hard a high goal to reach. It's unrealistic to expect "always" from anyone.

 It is not always easy to be a gentleman but it is the way I was raised. Besides it is the right thing to do.  
Tasha, Any man who treats you with disrespect is not a man for you.. It is not that one trait cancels out another the question is this....
Do All the traits balance each other out?

You need to measure all of him and not just a part of him...

No measuring needed on my part. He voluntarily showed me how small he truely is all on his own.  

 You know Orik, the more I get to know you the more fond I become of you as a person, a man and a friend.  :)


 

Orik

Well that leaves me rather at a loss of words. Thank you Natasha. I do not know what the man did to show how small he is, Just remember anyone may have a off day and it is possible you caught him at a bad moment.

I am not saying you should give him a second chance but you might find your measurement was off particularly so if you took them at a time when he may not have been at his best. Sometimes it is worth revisiting and taking some new measurements.

We are not supposed to be judgmental of one another, although the truth is we do it every single day. I can only hope I live up to a womans expectations, It is difficult enough living up to mine own expectations of myself.  

We continue in life as we know it. judging others and being judged. I sometimes think those of a nudist colony are often closer to one another because they have no need to hide and they are more open with one another because they have nothing to hide.
 
Never give up Never surrender Fight with ur last breath Fight 2 live & Fight 2 survive. Never say never & never say die. There comes a time when all will die A time we transcend & attain our place afterlife. My Fight is not yet done, I'm tired & I'd like to go home, But I'm not ready to go just yet.

irish bloke

Respect and manners are a two way street no matter what  the relationship you have with a person is. The minute a person ceases to be mannerly with you is the time you dont extend them the same favor in return.  ;)

Orik

 A simple truth there Irish. We are not always mannerly or capable of showing respect. There is times in our lives when we show the side we wish to hide most. That is the side that is of anger or hate  sometimes it is jealousy... Respect and good manners is with in us all...

The problem is we sometimes forget ourselves and we let the other side of our selves come to the front... Sadly that is the side remembered most.... All to often we are quick to remember the slights and we all to often forget the kindness...  Our lives are like a seesaw, one side is up and the other is down, to remain perfectly balanced, is the most difficult thing to do at the best of times.

Like a  kitten it can purr all night... But that time when the Dog comes to the front, when it Barks and snaps away at folks, well that is the side people will remember... They remember the big mean dog &amp; forget all about the soft fluffy kitten.

   
Never give up Never surrender Fight with ur last breath Fight 2 live & Fight 2 survive. Never say never & never say die. There comes a time when all will die A time we transcend & attain our place afterlife. My Fight is not yet done, I'm tired & I'd like to go home, But I'm not ready to go just yet.

irish bloke

Ah yes that is very true!  The negative aspects of ourselves do tend to be remembered more often than not. I have concluded long ago that it is common of the human condition as it is a way for us  to essentially walk away from relationships that may be toxic to our well being. After all if  we were to so quickly forgive and forget all   a persons misdeeds then they would tend to repeat themselves continually with no solution and most of all no end. it would  almost be a world full of no repurcussions for  our words  or actions.

I feel that sometimes it is necessary for  what you described to be remembered as it can be a learning  experience for both parties involved  whether the person is on the recieving or giving end of the negativity.

For example,the person on the recieving end can learn what they possibly did to incur  anger or  disdain   and the person "dishing  out" the negativity out can learn why they were prone to  the outburst  of anger  in this incident. In situations like this I feel that  we essentially learn about ourselves and others  and can progress  in a positive manner from this if we allow ourselves to even if the relationship doesnt continue due to our less than kind displays  of emotion we can   show to each other at times.

Essentially   what i am getting at is the worst of times can be turned into a positive aspect  that we can use to better ourselves  as human beings in the future.

Orik

Irish, you surprise me with what you have to say. It is a very observant truth on people today. The turning of ones negatives into a positive is never easy. The thing with change is we need to be open to it. If it takes a negative to turn it into a positive, so be it.

Our own memories of any incident tend to be flawed in that aspect. We will tend to remember our selves as better or more altruistic than what that situation might have actually been like. Basically we paint ourselves in a better light, than what someone else will see.

A stranger who meets us for the first time is more likely to see us for what we are, they see us as we are. they tend to see us without a veil over their eyes. . Until we can learn to see through the eyes of that stranger we will remain blind and unable to see our selves as flawed this is because our own id and our own ego our possessiveness &amp; selfishness gets within the way.

It takes a true friend to tell someone of their negatives and to be willing to show them to you. We men do not like to have our short comings pointed out to ourselves, We dislike it even more so if it is a woman pointing them out to ourselves.

Because of the blind spot, that veil we all wear, we can not see or own faults. this is when we need to rely on a good or a true friend. We need them to point our short comings out. If a friend does not point out our shortcomings... How can we ever change from them?

What is the saying to forgive is divine ? We should never forget the things we do or have had done to us. We should always be willing to forgive, however there is one problem with that, we judge ourselves to harshly. We are bad at forgiving one's own self.

No matter what our past sins, misdeeds or atrocities may have been we need to learn to forgive our selves. What ever it was that we may have committed in the past. Our past is just that, it is in the past. This is today and each day can begin anew. We do not have to stay the same, we do not have to live in the past. The problem is letting go of the things of our past and a willingness to move ahead into the future.

Sure we can change and become the better for it. however when we hold to tight to our own sin (past misdeeds) be what ever they may be. We do not like to let it go, the reason for this is because whether it is for the good or nought, It is the selfishness in us that makes us hold on to things that would be better served by their release, be it emotional or of the physical variety...

Men are hoarders particularly when it comes to the area of emotion. We just do not like to show it. we have been raised brought up that to show emotion or to cry is to show weakness and the weak are always the first to be killed, it is the strongest of the fittest after all that are the ones to survive.

Men need to learn that it is okay to show their emotions. A man can be strong and still show his emotional side. Until all of mankind can learn to share their feelings the true emotions they hide behind the walls they build there will always be atrocities...

Murder is not done so much out of hatred or anger it happens more so because during a moment of time when some one is so over come by years of emotional upheaval it suddenly explodes in a moment of blood and violence..

Murder is a thought that happens first. If we can not learn to stop that thought and control the emotion within it. Mankind is doomed to be trapped into violence of self. We can always learn something new from the past. But can we move forward and escape from the bonds of our forfathers can we break free of the emotions this selfish war that keeps us prisoner now ?

Jeez here is is on a Sunday night and we are defining the spirit of man and discussing the Id of society.

 
 
Never give up Never surrender Fight with ur last breath Fight 2 live & Fight 2 survive. Never say never & never say die. There comes a time when all will die A time we transcend & attain our place afterlife. My Fight is not yet done, I'm tired & I'd like to go home, But I'm not ready to go just yet.

Natasha

Orik wrote:
Well that leaves me rather at a loss of words. Thank you Natasha.

 You're very welcome.

 I do not know what the man did to show how small he is, Just remember anyone may have a off day and it is possible you caught him at a bad moment.

 I considered that. But when the arguement and name calling are on repeat, I doubt the problem is just a "bad moment".

I am not saying you should give him a second chance but you might find your measurement was off particularly so if you took them at a time when he may not have been at his best. Sometimes it is worth revisiting and taking some new measurements.

 I've done that as well. See Orik, when I come to have feelings for someone... anyone... if there are problems I tend to eventually get over it and ask them .. sometimes almost beg them back into my life. When two people come together be it friendship/relationship it's never easy and the two wont always see eye to eye. With this particular situation I believe the past has to much bearing on the present. With this latest outburst and name calling there are no need for new measurements as far as I'm concerned.

We are not supposed to be judgmental of one another, although the truth is we do it every single day.

 True. However, avoiding someone to secure your own well being isn't passing judgement.

 I can only hope I live up to a womans expectations, It is difficult enough living up to mine own expectations of myself.  

 I believe you'll do just fine  =)  You've made a lot of changes in your life. I'm sure you'll find a woman who will respect that and the strength it took accomplish this. You said you're a fighter and have fought for everything you've wanted and have. Sounds to me like you do a wonderful job of living up to your own expections.

We continue in life as we know it. judging others and being judged. I sometimes think those of a nudist colony are often closer to one another because they have no need to hide and they are more open with one another because they have nothing to hide.
 
Just because they live in a nudist colony doens't mean they have nothing to hide. It only means they are comfortable with the human body in it's naked form. That's how I see it anyway.

 

Natasha

Orik wrote:
Respect and good manners is with in us all...
What about serial killers? Do you think respect and good manner is within them as well. Some serial killers are sick and disturbed from a super young age. If they ever show respect and good manners I believe it's only to manipulate their prey making it not respect and good manners at all.


The problem is we sometimes forget ourselves and we let the other side of our selves come to the front... Sadly that is the side remembered most.... All to often we are quick to remember the slights and we all to often forget the kindness...  Our lives are like a seesaw, one side is up and the other is down, to remain perfectly balanced, is the most difficult thing to do at the best of times.
Also the influence of others on us comes into play as well.

 
&amp; forget all about the soft fluffy kitten.
I usually don't forget that part. It's why I tend to ask people back into my life. However, there are times when forgetting all about the soft fluffy kitten might be the best to do. No one wants to open themselves to repeated negative behavior or people.

 

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