It ain't easy to keep your cool.................................. so what is racism as Russ pointed? (//vny!://discoverseattle.net/forums/richedit/smileys/8.gif)
[FONT color=#0000ff][img height=120 alt="Michael Richards is seen in this Nov. 17, 2004 file photo in New York. (AP / Louis Lanzano)" src="vny!://images.ctv.ca/archives/CTVNews/img2/20061120/160_ap_kramer_061120.jpg" width=160 border=0][/FONT] Michael Richards is seen in this Nov. 17, 2004 file photo in New York. (AP / Louis Lanzano)
[FONT size=5]'Kramer' actor launches into racially charged rant[/FONT]
[P class=timeStamp]Updated Mon. Nov. 20 2006 2:51 PM ET
[P class=storyAttributes]CTV.ca News Staff
Michael Richards, the actor best known as Kramer from "Seinfeld," is in hot water after a racially charged tirade at a Los Angeles comedy club.
Richards lost his cool after repeated heckling from two black audience members during a stand-up routine at West Hollywood's Laugh Factory.
The 57-year-old actor-comedian, best known for his eccentric role as Kramer on the hit sitcom "Seinfeld," was performing at the Laugh Factory in West Hollywood Friday night when he started spewing the racial slurs, according to video posted on showbiz website TMZ.com.
The rant apparently began after the two audience members started yelling that he wasn't funny.
Richards retorted: "Shut up! Fifty years ago we'd have you upside down with a f------ fork up your a--."
But Richards' outburst didn't end there.
He then began pacing up and down the stage, yelling at the men for interrupting his routine in an expletive-laden tirade.
"You can talk, you can talk, you're brave now mother------. Throw his a-- out. He's a n-----!" Richards shouts before repeating the slur over and over again.
He also demanded one of the patrons be removed from the comedy club.
While there is some audible chuckling in the audience throughout the outburst, someone can be heard gasping "Oh my God" while others are heard to say "0oh" after Richard uses the n-word.
One of the men who was the object of the outburst shouted back that "That's un-f***ing called for, ain't necessary."
Richards eventually cut his act short and walked off the stage without any explanation.
The tape also shows audience members beginning to leave the comedy hall.
Richards performed the next night at the same comedy club without incident.
In a statement issued on Monday, Jerry Seinfeld said he felt sick over the "extremely offensive" comments, but he said that he was sure Richards felt the same way.
Calls to Richards' representatives from The Associated Press were not immediately returned early Monday.
CNN reported that he told the network off-camera that he felt sorry for what happened and that he had made amends.
Fellow comedian Paul Rodriguez, who was also on the bill Friday night, said Richards had some explaining to do.
"Once the word n----- comes out of your mouth, and you don't happen to be African-American then you have a whole lot of explaining," he told CNN.
While comedians often cross the lines of good taste within their acts, Rodriguez said Richards' remarks far surpassed the boundaries of what is acceptable.
"Freedom of speech has limitations and I think Michael Richards found those limitations," Rodriguez told the network.
[FONT size=1]Source: [/FONT][A href="vny!://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061120/michael_richards_tirade_061120/20061120?hub=Entertainment"][FONT size=1]vny!://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061120/michael_richards_tirade_061120/20061120?hub=Entertainment[/FONT][/A]
I bet he'll say he has an alcohol problem and go into rehab. Thats the in thing to do now apparently.
when does mel gibson perform?
Leave him alone. It was just a misunderstanding. Sheesh!
Well, I think I will always like Kramer, but any respect for Richards just went through the floor.
Here's Michael Richard during the ranting. Poor quality though but you can read the words.
You be the judge.
[A href="vny!://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjE0E5lgm9Q"]vny!://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjE0E5lgm9Q[/A]
I read on another website thats not all of it.. that the two that were heckling him were drunk and calling him a washed up cracka.. before that video started.
That being said from that video (to me) he tried to make a joke out of them being black with stereotyping jokes, and it backfired in a MAJOR way. He realized he went far too overboard and walked offstage.
Its a double standard with racial comments and jokes.
EDIT: I dont think his comments were in line in any way.. I just thought it looked like he wanted to make a run on joke about the two being black.
Well, double standard or not, you couldn't get me mad enough to use that kind of racial crap. I'm afraid I don't find that a very good excuse. If they were being asses, then he certainly within his rights to treat them like asses right back......that's it.
P.C. wrote:
Well, double standard or not, you couldn't get me mad enough to use that kind of racial crap. I'm afraid I don't find that a very good excuse. If they were being asses, then he certainly within his rights to treat them like asses right back......that's it.[/DIV]
Crap I knew I came across wrong.
I put too many comments jumbled together.
He shouldnt have racially made jokes about their race.
As for my comment about double standards I wasnt refering to this incident, I was being general about this comment.
Fellow comedian Paul Rodriguez, who was also on the bill Friday night, said Richards had some explaining to do.
"Once the word n----- comes out of your mouth, and you don't happen to be African-American then you have a whole lot of explaining," he told CNN.
While comedians often cross the lines of good taste within their acts, Rodriguez said Richards' remarks far surpassed the boundaries of what is acceptable.
I believe you cannot say that if you are of an ethnicity you can make racist comments against it while claiming racism when another ethnicity makes the same or similar jokes. Racist comments and words are racist comments and words.
I agree, Russ. When the nasty comments are made within an ethnic group, others will hear and assume those words are acceptable.
sounds like what I heard last night on 1040 AM Vancouver last night on the post game show for the canucks/lions. Lots of drunks lots of racial slurs/gay bashing by people from North Van and Mission and Chilliwack. Don't they screen calls anymore? What happend to the delay button? lol
What delay button? It's "free speech". I mean it's stupid, but it's free.
Probably the same dufuses that post on DV.
Russ, you didn't come across wrong at all. I wasn't 'calling you' on your comment, I was just making a 'general' comment. I don't agree with the racist jokes BY any ethnicity ABOUT any ethnicity, even if it's to 'their' own. But using those words in anger is just plain repulsive.
Down here they screen callers so if you sound drunk you don't get on and its on a seven second delay so if you cuss, you get hung up on by the radio station and the curse word doesn't air thus saving the radio station millions of dollars in fines from the FCC.
I think Canada is a little more liberal in that regard. There are limits, but there isn't such rigorous enforcement unless it is in print and clearly libellous.
I think you're right kitten, free speech is a little different up here. Its 'liberal' free speech up here, its a harder to sue.
Most radio stations do screen their calls, but sometimes its live and not prescreened.
Some of their talk shows are so bad that if they screened them they would have nothing but dead air space!
kitten wrote:
I think Canada is a little more liberal in that regard. There are limits, but there isn't such rigorous enforcement unless it is in print and clearly libellous.
Yeah its a little goofy. Howard Stern was what on the air for a week up in Montreal and Toronto? Yet I watch the CBC and people they interview say 'f*ck' all the time and its not bleeped. Here heads would be rolling if that happend here and right wing conservative groups would be saying 'what about the childern omg there lives are completely ruined' (case in point boobgate or wardrobe malfunction-gate.)
I think with your system, its alot more regulated due to the publics opinion. And alot of your population is 'bible belt'.
I have been known to be wrong however, lol.
yup people would be put in prison for life here if they showed what citytv shows on friday nights.
Russ wrote: Crap I knew I came across wrong.
I put too many comments jumbled together.
Just in case you missed this Russ, I thought I would bring it forward a page....lol
P.C. wrote: Russ, you didn't come across wrong at all. I wasn't 'calling you' on your comment, I was just making a 'general' comment. [/DIV]
Ah, thanks PC. I thought I had come across wrong. Have had that problem before with the internet and forums. Hard to express sometimes with a few lines. (//vny!://discoverseattle.net/forums/richedit/cliparts/5.gif)
I couldn't agree more. I've even re-read some of my own posts, and thought.....what the heck were you trying to say? LOL [img style="CURSOR: pointer" onclick=url(this.src); src="vny!://www.cheesebuerger.de/images/more/bigs/c033.gif" border=0]
Remember when Frank Costanza insisted on calling it "the manssiere" as opposed to Kramer's "bro?" Remember how Frank said "the bro" was too ethnic?
He should have left it at the '50 years ago...' comment, or used any number of racial lines that would have been both edgy and humourous in the context of black guys heckling him based on his race. But he became genuinely angry and went for the jugular in a way that was devoid of any humour, even in a tasteless sense.
The fact of the matter is that Michael Richards is really not a good stand-up artist, so he had no clue how to handle himself in that situation. Almost any good comedian could have handled that better and ended up on top. But this is a guy who manages himself, and is known for being very difficult to work with. He turned down Monk, for god's sake, because of an argument.
And I hated Kramer.
You're right, Trollio. He should have more sense and tact to handle that situation properly. No excuse.
(//vny!://i9.tinypic.com/3025hdv.jpg)
But to hate Kramer? NOOoooooooo! I thought his character on Seinfield was funny but to each his own.
Trollio wrote:The fact of the matter is that Michael Richards is really not a good stand-up artist, so he had no clue how to handle himself in that situation. Almost any good comedian could have handled that better and ended up on top. But this is a guy who manages himself, and is known for being very difficult to work with. He turned down Monk, for god's sake, because of an argument.
I think you can tell a comic's skill or even comedy genius by how they handle hecklers and this guy's obviously a one-trick-pony hack.
Is managing yourself kind of like representing ones self in court? Something about a fool for a client.
And thank gawd he didn't do the Monk gig. He would've ruined a great show with his mugging.
Last night was the first time I tuned in to Seinfeld since I learned of this. I was pretty certain I had it nicely compartmentalized that Kramer is Kramer and Richards is Richards.....but I was disappointed (with myself ????) that I couldn't view it the same way.
I never thought Seinfeld was funny. Never got why it was so popular.
Love it. Better than a night-cap.
I DIDN'T tune in when it was popular, mind you. But since, I've seen each episode at the very least 20 times. I used to watch the news before bed, but quit doing that a couple years ago. I decided I would rather be uninformed. I like to fall asleep after a good laugh, and Seinfeld does that for me.
Ah I see lol before I go to bed I get the news updates from the BBC World Service. lol. I'm such a nerd. BBC can get rather depressing though at times. I'd love to work for the BBC but man would my doctor bills be high. Depressing stuff. BBC World News the anti fluff network.
That's it exactly, Sportsdude. I watch just enough news to stay on top of things. I found it too depressing. It affected my day, my night and my sleep. So I eliminated it.
When Im on the ships off Africa, we would tune into the BBC every night to get the latest news. Theres also a Canadian Version of the BBC that most people dont realize exists.
Yeah I used to have nightmares about Cherynobyl and it happening here. (there's a nuclear plant by my house)
yeah BBC Canada.
you work on ships? What do you do? I'm a courier.
The simple fact is, Michael Richards INSULTED those two a**holes, and he was provoked into insulting them by themselves knowingly and willingly.
No one tell me they didn't know it and didn't have it coming !
The fact of insulting them using ethnically/racially sensitive words is a minor detail in the overall context of the act of insulting. Why using "racist" epithets while insulting someone should constitute a more serious crime than when just "insulting" someone, is beyond me.
JGG (formerly known as Jolly Green Giant and Mutilated Mind, both having been, to all practical extents and purposes, stolen)
I can only guess, that you haven't actually read what he said to these people. How anyone could defend that is beyond me. Like I said in an earlier post, you couldn't get me mad enough to use that kind of racial crap.
If they were being asses, then he's certainly within his rights to treat them like asses right back......that's it. If someone is an ass, they are just an ass. They are not an ass because of their race, so why would you choose to insult their race, instead of directing your insults to the fact that they are asses.
Phew !!! That's the most times I've ever said ass in such a short space.
P.C. wrote:
I can only guess, that you haven't actually read what he said to these people. How anyone could defend that is beyond me. Like I said in an earlier post, you couldn't get me mad enough to use that kind of racial crap.
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I think it's you who didn't actually read what he said to them... and I am not guessing, I know it. You didn't read that post where it said that BEFORE that movie clip starts they are trying to get him wound up with racial taunts such as "washed-up cracka" ? So if you just watch the video clip, you don't know about that part.
You should be careful before you talk about "that racial crap". There's usually much more going on than meets the eye.
JGG (formerly known as Jolly Green Giant and Mutilated Mind, both having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
And another detail, P.C.
Don't you think it's a bit strange that movie clip shows only Michael Richards' "ugly side" as you or someone else put it but not the provocations of those two men ?
How handy that just at the right moment someone shot this clip...
JGG (formerly known as Jolly Green Giant and Mutilated Mind, having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
There isn't any "context" that can make it OK to shout N-bombs at the top of your lungs in a "joke" that isn't even remotely funny. He obviously got his feelings hurt and wanted to hurt back.
Like I said before, true comedians can handle hecklers and turn the tables on them. If he can't handle hecklers he shouldn't be doing stand-up. Maybe it's the only gig a washed-up no-talent hack can get anymore.
Future Canadian wrote:
There isn't any "context" that can make it OK to shout N-bombs at the top of your lungs in a "joke" that isn't even remotely funny. He obviously got his feelings hurt and wanted to hurt back.
Like I said before, true comedians can handle hecklers and turn the tables on them. If he can't handle hecklers he shouldn't be doing stand-up. Maybe it's the only gig a washed-up no-talent hack can get anymore.
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Are you one of those two hecklers perchance ? That would explain your defending their right to heckle and trying to take away Richards' right to be left alone while doing his act...
JGG (formerly known as Jolly Green Giant and Mutilated Mind, having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
JGG....I don't care what's going on that hasn't met my eyes. If you're OK with defending racial slurs....fly at it. I'm simpley saying, there is NEVER a situation that makes it acceptable on any level in my opinion
If that-guy-who-played-Cosmo was a real professional he would've put those disrespectful hecklers in their place right away, for they are obviously the ones that started it. But he lost his shit because he can't hack it.
If you defend that kind of language you look as bad as the person doing it.
Oh now, it's plain crazy!! The two hecklers are now asking for compensation. A public apology from Richards should be sufficient. He's already been branded and humilated. I think they should let the past be.
[FONT size=6]Men seek apology, maybe money, from Richards[/FONT]
[P class=timeStamp]Updated Sat. Nov. 25 2006 11:33 AM ET
[P class=storyAttributes]Associated Press
[!-- dateline --]LOS ANGELES[!-- /dateline --] -- Two men who say they were insulted by actor-comedian Michael Richards during his racist rant at a comedy club want a personal apology and maybe some money, one of the men and their lawyer said Friday.
Frank McBride and Kyle Doss said they were part of a group of about 20 people who had gathered at West Hollywood's Laugh Factory to celebrate a friend's birthday. According to their attorney, Gloria Allred, they were ordering drinks when Richards berated them for interrupting his act.
When one of their group replied that he wasn't funny, Richards launched into a string of obscenities and repeatedly used the n-word. A video cell phone captured the outburst.
Richards, who played Jerry Seinfeld's wacky neighbor Kramer on the TV sitcom "Seinfeld," made a nationally televised apology on the "Late Show with David Letterman" earlier this week. He has since apologized to the Revs. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, both civil rights leaders.
But Doss, 26, said Friday he wanted a "face-to-face apology."
"To have him do what he did to me ... I can't even explain it," Doss said. "I was humiliated, even scared at one point."
Richards' publicist said his client wants to apologize to both men, who are black, but hasn't been able to locate them.
Allred, speaking by phone from Colorado, said Richards should meet McBride and Doss in front of a retired judge to "acknowledge his behavior and to apologize to them" and allow the judge to decide on monetary compensation.
"It's not enough to say 'I'm sorry' on 'David Letterman,'" she said.
She did not mention a specific figure, but pitched the idea as a way for the comic to avoid a lawsuit.
"Our clients were vulnerable," Allred said. "He went after them. He singled them out and he taunted them, and he did it in a closed room where they were captive."
The video of Richards' outburst shows several people getting up and walking out as he shouts at the audience.
Richards' publicist said the comic wasn't considering any demand for payment. "He's not dealing with that," Howard Rubenstein said. "He wants to apologize to them directly and then see what happens."
[FONT size=1]Source: [/FONT][A href="vny!://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061125/richards_suit_061125/20061125?hub=TopStories"][FONT size=1]vny!://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061125/richards_suit_061125/20061125?hub=TopStories[/FONT][/A]
LOL, you knew this was only a matter of time. They see dollar signs when something happens to people now, especially since he is supposed to be a celebrity.
Drat, I cant edit my posts.
Sorry SD, didnt notice your question.
Yes, Im a marine engineer. I work on vessels offshore africa and china. Like china, am tired of africa.
Lise wrote:
Oh now, it's plain crazy!! The two hecklers are now asking for compensation. A public apology from Richards should be sufficient. He's already been branded and humilated. I think they should let the past be.
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Crazy you say ? Isn't it obvious to any who have eyes AND dare to see what kind of a**holes those two really are ? I already said it before : they probably did it on purpose, knowingly, with the intention to break his career.
"Racial slurs" are far too good a treatment for that kind of "persons" !!!
Just think of the kind of treatment THEY would inflict on people they don't like, if they had only half a chance !
And you people think "racial slurs" are the most horrid crime inimaginable ?
Are you really THAT STUPID ?
Actually you are.
He
(formerly successively known as JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant, all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
The SHEER EVIL of it ... I can't believe it.
They called him a " washed up cracka" first. They were in a group of ... how many ? Twenty people ! In an ill-lit room, while Richards was up there on stage.
And now this lawyer is turning the whole thing around and Richards is the evil guy ... he "singled them" out !!!
This is too incredible for words !!!
And one of those two even has the gall of stating that he "felt scared" !!!
Scared ? Of what ? Of Richards' hard-hitting fists ?
Just picture the situation (if that's not asking too much)
He
(formerly successively known as JGG, Jolly Green Giant and Mutilated Mind, all having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
Nevermind, I am just as stupid, or probably more stupid than any of you.
He wrote:
Nevermind, I am just as stupid, or probably more stupid than any of you.
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Whoever you are, I think you don't even understand what I was writing about. It's probably the sheer frustration of it which makes you steal my nicks.
He
(formerly known as JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant, all of which having now been, to all intents and purposes, stolen)
He wrote:
He
(formerly known as JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant, all of which having now been, to all intents and purposes, stolen)
I thought you were registered as JGG. How does one steal your nick?
lol 49er........stay with the tour.
sorry....I have a habit of wandering off
P.C. wrote:
lol 49er........stay with the tour.
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lol Mind your business P.C. lol ... lol lol and lol+ (for good measure)
lol You lol lol don't like someone taking a honest interest in what's happening, do you ?
We
(formerly known as Him, He, JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant ... all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
49er wrote:
He wrote:
He (formerly known as JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant, all of which having now been, to all intents and purposes, stolen)
I thought you were registered as JGG. How does one steal your nick?
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I am not registered on this site under any nick, 49er.
All the nicks I used have been registered by some a**hole to force me into registering (at first at least), maybe later with the intent to just pester me.
So if you see any of those nicks (such as JGG) as registered - it's not me.
We (formerly known as Him, He, JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant... all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
Wow! Am I like the biggest f*ckTARD, EVAR?!!!!!
We (formerly known as Him, He, JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant... all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
We wrote:
Wow! Am I like the biggest f*ckTARD, EVAR?!!!!!
Yes.
We wrote:
We (formerly known as Him, He, JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant... all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
I swear, if life had a Stupid Meter, you'd be off the f*cking scale. Oh, look...
[span style="font-family: Courier New; font-weight: bold;"][............/][/span][br style="font-family: Courier New; font-weight: bold;"][span style="font-family: Courier New; font-weight: bold;"]Stupid-O-Meter[/span]
It's pathetically obvious that you like playing the victim role more than anything, but it's just become terribly old and dreary. No one really gives a crap about you or your imagined trials and tribulations. (I can't believe I'm even bothering to respond to you, but it's a slow night around here.) The more I see your drivel the more likely it is that I'll switch the forum over to "registration only".
Anyone with half a brain is already registered, so it's not like it'll make much of a difference to anyone but you. And if it would keep you from soiling the board with your pointless bullshit, it would be worth it. I don't know...I'll have to think about it.
Normally at this point I'd say something like "your thoughts are welcome", but they're not. Other people are welcome to sound off or put forth an opinion but I'll probably just ignore anything you have to say. In spite of that, I order you to respond. (//forums/richedit/smileys/Happy/14.gif)
Order away or f*ck off to your heart's content.
I am just not playing your games, that's all.
If you people actually placed any value on "mature and intelligent conversation", that's what you would do, but you have shown yourselves to be a small-minded bunch of apparently semi-retarded somethings....
My genuine contributions to actual discussion were not appreciated because you people couldn't have those.... be sure I can't really appreciate that. Perhaps now you would drop your stupid little games, so we can go back to "mature and intelligent discussion" ?
We (formerly known as Him, He, JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant... all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
We wrote:
Order away or f*ck off to your heart's content.
I am just not playing your games, that's all.
If you people actually placed any value on "mature and intelligent conversation", that's what you would do, but you have shown yourselves to be a small-minded bunch of apparently semi-retarded somethings....
My genuine contributions to actual discussion were not appreciated because you people couldn't have those.... be sure I can't really appreciate that. Perhaps now you would drop your stupid little games, so we can go back to "mature and intelligent discussion" ?
We (formerly known as Him, He, JGG, Mutilated Mind and Jolly Green Giant... all of which having been, to all practical intents and purposes, stolen)
You are getting chicken poo and rocks in your stocking this year.
You ara a BAD GIRL!!!
My genuine contributions to actual discussion were not appreciated because you people couldn't have those.... be sure I can't really appreciate that. Perhaps now you would drop your stupid little games, so we can go back to "mature and intelligent discussion
Good one! We love a good joke here on DS, and you are the biggest one here. Keep coming back for more punishment please. We've come to revel in your chronic angst. But as for going back to "mature and intelligent discussion", we are sorry, but it will not be possible to revisit something that never existed, at least not with you .
Your immaturity is surpassed only by your unwarranted self-esteem. (Or maybe it's the other way round.)
Our contempt for you is not a game. You've earned it. Just relax and enjoy it, as we do.
99% OF US...
Now, a few years after posting, I have again taken a look at this and can only conclude that I must have been kind of sensitive on this subject as I obviously got too angry and wrote some things I shouldn't have. One should normally td his best to keep his poise and avoid getting into ad hominems, but there it is... I surely overdid it in some places, and it's easy to see now, years after the fact.
But earning all of your contempt as you were implying, 99¨OF US ?
Maybe you overdid it a bit yourself ? Anyone can sometimes say things he wouldn't at another time.
Krammer made the show. Otherwise one's mostly watching two nerds act like sissies. There should have been more Krammer is some of the episodes.