Should we pay carbon tax?

[Lise]

What do you guys think about this carbon tax that's coming in effect? Should we pay for it? I think.... well, we should pay because we do use a lot of pollution. It's only fair that we should pay for it. However, the money gained from this should go (technically speaking) into fixing the problem.

 

What are your thoughts?

 

 

What is a carbon tax?

A carbon tax is an example of a what's called a Pigovian tax, as advocated by British economist Arthur Pigou (1877-1959).

When an activity has a negative social cost, such as pollution, Pigou argued that it should be taxed. That, according to his theory, provides an incentive to stop the social harm and move to more positive alternatives — a similar idea to "sin taxes" on products such as alcohol and tobacco.

So the idea of a carbon tax is to turn people and businesses away from "bad" fossil fuels and toward "good" clean alternatives. Under some models, it can also provide funds to help combat the wider effects of climate change, with the idea that the "polluter pays" for green initiatives.

In practice, a carbon tax can be:

• an across-the-board levy on all fuels based on CO2 (carbon dioxide) emissions. 
• applied to just the businesses that produce carbon emissions, leaving it up to them whether or not to pass costs along to consumers 
• directly levied on consumers.

Under a "revenue-neutral" carbon tax, any levies that would be extracted from a particular sector — say, transportation — would be returned in the form of a subsidy or tax break.

The tax level is often calculated in terms of dollar cost per tonne of emissions. This can then be translated into a cost on the fuel that emits the greenhouse gases (e.g.: 10 cents a litre on gasoline).

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[Van]

I have a hard time believing any Canadian needs another tax on anything. There should be more than enough surplus of what we already get taxed now for investment in other energy technologies. I am sick of taxes as I feel I can not pay anymore than what I do now.

 

The dork Dion is a bumbling fool and I would put more trust in the leader of Burma to handle any more of my taxed money. Don't get me wrong, Harper is doing nothing for the environment either. Dion will do nothing too, the only difference is, I will have less money in my pocket.

 

Revenue Neutral???  Biggest load of dog turds I have ever heard come out of Dion's mouth. Until the Fiberals get a real leader, I hope they stay in the doghouse too.

[P.C.]

I'm sorry.....I'm not up for another tax either.

 

I recycle, I reuse, I conserve, I repurpose..........I feel like I'm doing as much as I can. 

 

So my answer is NO.....I do not want to be penalized for those who aren't doing their share (and never will if someone else has to pay for it)

[Sportsdude]

Campbell and Dion enact plans that don't do anything. If its neutral what's the point? It goes to nothing, it's lip service.
 

[P.C.]

I think they should be directing their energy to the big companies who crank out products that are obsolete within a couple years....no parts to be had to repair them....cheaper to buy new......guess where it goes.  Landfill.  Start enforcing some guidelines for at least some degree of compatibility in appliances and electronics.  Granted, technology doesn't stand still for a lot of things....but a toaster is a toaster, a kettle is a kettle....a coffee maker is a coffee maker.  Change the shape, but jeeeez.....let me at least be able to have my year old coffee machine FIXED instead of chucking it for a new one.

 

The truckers who ship....well....EVERYTHING.... will have to pass on these costs to the consumer and then yet another tax of top of that?  How is it saving the planet if a person can't afford to put food on the table ?

[Sportsdude]

As a society I think we need to come to the realization that our societies we built after the war are flawed. More then ever do we really need to wipe the slate clean and start over (alas this is impossible who's going to sanction of tearing down miles and miles of suburban sprawl). Humans and ideas change over time ebb and flow, strongest survive etc. The problem is our cities and towns developed wrong and will become our downfall. We are still stuck in this post war concept of needing to build everything around the car (car dependent society). No carbon tax is going to fix the fundamental problem of our communities unless we drastically change. That's the problem though we're in this in between zone of yes we want to change, but we want this this this and this 'cake and eat it too' as well.

Either everyone comes together as a collective and forces change or we take the kicking and screaming option.
 

[P.C.]

I saw some numb head do a report on the news last night about some guy who moved from the suburbs into the city.  They ran down a lengthy list of costs he no longer had to face.  Convenient public transit, sold his car....no gas or insurance to purchase.........blah blah blah......

 

However, they DIDN'T cover exactly how it was going to work if everyone decided to leave the suburbs and live in the city.

   

[Sportsdude]

Easy. Tear down the ghost towns which the suburbs will become and rebuild the cities to be sustainable. You know, bring back all the trolley's and tram lines that were prevalent before the wars started.
 

[Van]

I agree it is up to us humans to do the actual change. Waiting for the government to give us 'hand outs' after taxing the f*ck out of us is as smart as waiting for a cigarette company to help someone with lung cancer. No solution as far as I am concerned.

Yeah PC, I always wonder that too? Where would everyone live when suburbia is over, in one bedroom condos? I think most families would rather jump off of a bridge than move to condo-urbia. You will probably see a lot of that too I guess.

[P.C.]

Yeah PC, I always wonder that too? Where would everyone live when suburbia is over, in one bedroom condos? I think most families would rather jump off of a bridge than move to condo-urbia. You will probably see a lot of that too I guess.

 

I'd be the first one over.

 

I think it's all about personal responsibility....and frankly, there are still a lot of people not doing their part.  If each individual has played a part in getting us to where we are, than each individual can impact the outcome by doing things differently.

[Van]

P.C. wrote:

 

I'd be the first one over.

 

I think it's all about personal responsibility....and frankly, there are still a lot of people not doing their part.  If each individual has played a part in getting us to where we are, than each individual can impact the outcome by doing things differently.

It is a tough situation. I know I don't waste gas on my daily rat race routine.

That being said, until the price gets too high to do so, I am going to continue driving around BC (especially the Kootenays), Alberta, and the USA. My trip to Italy is also still tentative for next year. And I will still turn up my stereo very loud.

Canada's biggest issue seems to be our size. It is hard to sit in one spot to try and conserve when friends, family, festivals, adventure, LIFE spans across a huge area.

[P.C.]

I think there are trade offs......and I don't think one person has to give up everything.  Going for little road trips is something I totally enjoy....and will continue to do it.  It's just a matter of being extra diligent in other areas.  I don't think one person has to do everything....but if every person does one thing...it will make a difference. (well.....at LEAST one thing)

[P.C.]

SD wrote:  Easy. Tear down the ghost towns which the suburbs will become and rebuild the cities to be sustainable. You know, bring back all the trolley's and tram lines that were prevalent before the wars started.

 

Sorry SD.....I disagree that this is where the root of the problem is.  Trolley's and trams aren't the solution.  I think we're where we are because consumerism has run amuck.  The need to have everything....more of everything, the best of everything, the newest of everything and we are willing to sacrifice everything to get it.  I know it sounds disconnected from the problems, but I don't think it is.

[Russ]

No.

 

and dont start telling me we all need to get new this and that cause they are this environmentally friendly. People that say that are idiots cause it takes MORE resources and pollution to make the new ones than it is to continue to use the older more polluting things. If you have something now thats still running, use that until its time to replace then upgrade.

 

Its all the sky is falling routine.

 

Dont get me started.

[Van]

Nice Russ!

 

I also hear a lot of "Well, if you were in parts of Europe, your tax and costs would be way higher". Don't get me started on that!

 

Lets just get the Libs to tax 100% of our income and we can live in shanty towns in mud huts with 15 people in them.