Homeland Security IS the new Gestapo

Started by TRUTH, Mar 06 06 07:57

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TRUTH

Capital Hill Blue is reporting that recently a retired Texas schoolteacher and his wife had a little run-in with the Department of Homeland Security. The crime? [a href="http://www.capitolhillblue.com/blog/2006/03/warning_financial_responsibili.html"]Paying down some debt[/a]. That was it. That was ALL it took to get their accounts frozen, and it cost them considerable time and money to "defend" themselves...against their own government. And they had done nothing wrong. Nothing!

From the article: 'The balance on their JC Penney Platinum MasterCard had gotten to an unhealthy level. So they sent in a large payment, a check for $6,522. And an alarm went off. A red flag went up. The Soehnges' behavior was found to be "questionable".  

They were told, as they moved up the managerial ladder at the call center, that the amount they had sent in was much larger than their normal monthly payment. And if the increase hits a certain percentage higher than that normal payment, "Homeland Security has to be notified".[hr style="width: 100%; height: 2px;"]Still think Homeland Security is here to protect you? They're not. Their job is to terrorize you.

Future Canadian

Department of Homeland Security is an absolute joke! I heard on Air America today about lax security and general ineptitude at their own building. Recently an envelope with an unknown suspicious powder was found there. So dude (whoever this was I forget) picks it up with his bare hands, walks by horrified security guards, walks by DHS director Chertoff's office, and just dumps it out his window.
Unbelievable. I really feel safe from another Anthrax attack now.
...religion has made some contributions to civilization. It helped in the early days to fix the calendar, and it caused Egyptian priests to chronicle ecplipses with such care that in time they were able to predict them. These two services I am prepared to acknowledge, but I do not know of any others

US Citizen

Is THIS was the Patriot Act was supposed to be for? Hmmmmm?

[span style="background-color: rgb(255, 159, 64);"]Patriot Act Includes Crackdown on Meth Use[/span]

By LAURIE KELLMAN
Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Suffer from springtime allergies? You could be among the first affected by the USA Patriot Act poised for final congressional passage this week.

Besides terrorism, the bill takes aim at the production of methamphetamine, a highly addictive drug that cannot be manufactured without a key ingredient of everyday cold and allergy medicines. The bill would impose new limits next month for how much relief a person can buy over the counter.

And beginning Sept. 30, it'll take a flash of ID to buy that medication.

The legislation sponsored by Sens. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif. and Jim Talent, R-Mo., would blanket the nation with one policy that would put medicines containing pseudoephedrine behind the counter and out of the reach of meth cooks.

"If we leave it up to local jurisdiction, we're simply going to move the problem from one jurisdiction to another without addressing the root cause," said Fresno, Calif., Police Chief Jerry Dyer.

Pass a state or local law cracking down on methamphetamine production, set off a cycle that goes something like this:

The black market price of cold tablets needed to make the drug skyrockets, driving the meth makers to the jurisdiction next door. There, they buy it in bulk - legally, cheaply, anonymously.

That is, until that state or city gets tough on meth with new laws of its own.

Rather than wait for localities to stitch together a patchwork of anti meth policies, the provision of the Patriot Act would leave meth producers nowhere to run but out of the country. It takes aim at the meth trade's weakest point - the supply of pseudoephedrine.

Beginning 30 days after President Bush signs the law, expected sometime this week, purchase limits go into effect. One person would be limited to buying 300, 30-mg pills in a month or 120 such pills in a day. The measure would make an exception for "single-use" sales - individually packaged pseudoephedrine products.

Many retailers, such as Kmart, Walgreens, Target and Wal-Mart, have already adopted guidelines to limit customer access to cold products or to limit their sales. Similar state and local restrictions have caused seizures of meth labs to plunge by double-digit percentages in such states as Arkansas, Oregon and Missouri.

At the same time, drug agents began finding more meth from Mexican cartels on the street.

Still, closing down domestic meth labs is of unique urgency to public health and safety, law enforcement officials said.

The drug is made in clandestine labs with battery acid, drain cleaner or other chemicals that help turn the cold and allergy medicine into powder.

One quart of ether, another ingredient, holds the explosive power of several sticks of dynamite, said Sgt. Jason Grellner of the Franklin County, Mo., Narcotics Enforcement Unit, which has seized 600 meth labs since 1998 in a jurisdiction of 100,000 people.

Wading into the toxic soup of a meth lab puts officers in situations for which they are not necessarily trained, Grellner said.

"They have to know the job of a hazardous-waste chemist. They have to have the mindset of a firefighter. They have to be a natural-resources worker," Grellner said. "Wearing that many hats is a safety concern."

And an abandoned lab becomes an environmental hazard, pointed out Dyer.

"They were leaving the chemicals and equipment out in the open and vacating the property," Dyer said. "They found out that we started to trace down suspects with that equipment. Now they are burying these same items underground."

Oklahoma provides evidence that driving out meth labs doesn't mean getting rid of meth. Oklahoma's meth lab seizures have fallen 90 percent since April 2004, when it became the first state to ban over-the-counter sales of everyday cold and allergy medications.

At the same time, seizures of smokeable Mexican meth known as "crystal ice" rose nearly fivefold, from 384 cases in the 15 months before the law to 1,875 since.

"We're going to see trafficking by Mexican cartel organizations, on a much larger scale," Grellner said.
 

primefactor

That's it. I'm getting a Victoria's Secret card and maxing it out. It's the patriotic thing to do!

If I don't buy some new thongs, the terrorists win.

soapbox

foolish to say that homeland security at all behaves like the national socialist era secret police.(gestapo).

neither the policies or methods are the same and their is no comparison whatsoever.

there are checks and balances within the united states and it's security apparatus.there is a seperation of judiciary and government.there are hundreds of other disimilarities.

research the horrific realities of the NSDAP revolutionary government of that era and you will realize the ignorance with which you speak.  

TRUTH

soapbox wrote:
foolish to say that homeland security at all behaves like the national socialist era secret police.(gestapo).

No, it's not. The similarities are unmistakable.
[/div][div] [/div][div]neither the policies or methods are the same and their is no comparison whatsoever.[/div][div]
Horsecrap, plain and simple. Indefinite detention without being charged, snooping through your mail without a warrant, summary incarceration forever without being charged with anythng (except for those "secret" laws), governmental endorsement of torture....I don't see much of a difference.


[/div][div]there are checks and balances within the united states and it's security apparatus.there is a seperation of judiciary and government.there are hundreds of other disimilarities.[/div][div]
You're stupid enough to believe anything, aren't you? What "checks and balances" exist when they can do the things mentioned above? I'll tel you: NONE. Now go back to worshipping George Bush, you f*cking fool.

[/div][div]research the horrific realities of the NSDAP revolutionary government of that era and you will realize the ignorance with which you speak.[/div][div] [/div][div]Research it yourself, dumbo.  All you have to do is look around and you'll see what a blind, sheep-like noncompoop you are.
[/div][div]

Quenyar

[!-- Begin Summary --]The Patriot Act is an insult and an affront to every American who believes in America as the cradle of freedom, liberty, and equal rights to all under law. This becomes more and more clear every week as the Department of Homeland Security takes more and more to wage war on the rights and human dignity of the American citizen.[/p][!-- End Summary --][!-- Begin Body --]In our consumer-driven materialistic society, what is the best way to guarantee control over people? You control people through their money. The example of a Texas school teacher, as reported in Capital Hill Blue, who attempted to pay down his credit card debt and had his family's assets frozen by the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) because their conduct was "questionable." Anyone who sends in a larger than "normal" payment to their creditors is reported to DHS by law and may look forward to the same consequences.[/p]Do you have hay fever? Do you take anything for it? If so, very soon you will need to produce identification at your pharmacy to buy your medicine. Why? Because the DHS is using provisions in the Patriot Act to require your local druggist[/p][ol][li]to demand proof of identity [/li][li]to record your identity and keep it on file [/li][li]to provide those records whenever the government asks for them [/li][/ol]The reason why Homeland Security is requiring druggists to be their unpaid informants? Because drugs are a threat to the nation. I'm no fan of drugs, but I didn't know that the DHS was supposed to be keeping me "safe" from everything. What about the next time I want to go to Canada. If somebody gets sick in Canada, I might be bringing that disease with me. Sounds like a good reason to keep citizens from going abroad. And if I decide to keep some money stuffed in a ma tress, so that in the event that DHS freezes my assets for six months for no reason, my children can eat regularly - that's very suspicious behavior.[/p]This is just exactly how the Nazis worked. They had a small elite force of counter-insurgency specialists, the Gestapo, but they relied on ordinary people to do most of their spying and leg work for them. Did I take a subversive book out of the library? The librarian doesn't want to get into trouble and the law says she must report these things. Does my neighbor do something unusual, something I don't know what he's doing? He might be doing something illegal and if I fail to inform on him I'll be in trouble, too.[/p]If Heinrich Himler could have, he would have has a TV program like "Germany's Most Wanted" on in a heartbeat. As it was, they had patriotic posters on every street corner, reminding people to be good citizens. Complaining about the government interfering in private areas of ordinary peoples' lives made you an enemy of the state because it questioned the right of the state to maintain security. The only thing missing from DHS PR hand outs are art decco eagles flanking idealized portraits of George W Bush.[/p]Apart from all the presumptions that if we didn't have the Patriot Act many more terrorists acts would have been committed, I have yet to see any credible, tangible evidence that the things DHS does have any real effect on a determined terrorist adversary. They've made it horrible to fly anywhere, but they haven't implemented a single restriction on corporate jets. Any self-respecting, moderately well-funded terrorist could fly a plane load of who knows what into any out of hundreds of US airports from abroad and face about the same scrutiny and security as the average foreign tourist could expect in 1955.[/p]Why is this? Because wealth, powerful and influential people take corporate jets and they will get you fired from your cushy job with DHS if you piss them off.[/p]By the time DHS has everybody carrying a federal electronic identity card, which must match your RFID identity chip and match the RFID chips in your clothes and personal effects (matching the list of your kown purchases), it will probably be too late. By that time, we will have given away the structure of our nation to despots, thieves, and liars of every sort. We will then have no alternative than to burn that building down and start afresh from a solid foundation that begins with citizens who not only expect liberty and freedom, but demand it.[/p][!-- End Body --]

weird al


TehBorken

I occasionally make transfers from a business account to my personal account.  The amounts differ and sometimes it's a little, sometimes it's a lot.

I fully expect that Homeland Security will get some kind of notice of my "odd" and "inconsistent" banking actions and will freeze my accounts while they "investigate". The fact that I own both accounts and that every penny can be traced back to a legitimate customer will make no difference to them, they'll freeze my account anyway "just to be on the safe side".

If you make (for example) a $3000 transfer, you ring a bell with the banking industry and Homeland Security. It's enough to get noticed. But, if you make 3 transfers of $1000, then they say you're "attempting to evade the regulations" on transfer reporting! It's incredible- no matter what you do they can f*ck you for it.
The real trouble with reality is that there's no background music.

tenkani

I didn't read everything above so forgive me if this has already been said.

Naming it the "Patriot Act" is a cynical, deceptive ploy. The implication is obvious; the act itself represents patriotism and so it follows that those who oppose it are not patriots. According to Ann Coulter and her ilk, in fact, those who oppose the act are traitors.

The American Heritage Dictionary defines a patriot as "one who loves, supports, and defends one's country."

The sadly ironic part is that those who are pushing the Patriot Act generally claim to revere our founding fathers and assert that they are fighting to protect the values that our forefathers died to enshrine in law.

Nothing could be further from the truth. As has already been stated, we are moving into an era when indefinite detention without trial, torture and surveilance of U.S. citizens (all undertaken without oversight of the courts, negating the checks and balances the founding fathers had envisioned) becomes commonplace. It is now patriotic to shit on the graves of our founding fathers.

As a fan of George Orwell, I am acutely aware of the fact that language is being systematically destroyed and re-purposed in my country in order to cripple the reasoning ability of its citizens, kicking the crutches out from our already feeble critical thinking skills.

  Political language... is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind.
-George Orwell
For thou art with me; thy cream and thy sugar they comfort me
Thou preparest a carafe before me in the presence of Juan Valdez
Thou anointest my day with pep; my mug runneth over
Surely richness and taste shall follow me all the days of my life
And I will dwell in the house of coffee forever.

weird al

Came across this today...

 [FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff40"]  [FONT face="Comic Sans MS"] "They keep talking about drafting a Constitution for Iraq.  Why
don't we just give them ours?  It was written by a lot of really smart
guys, and it's worked for over 200 years.
 And, we're not using it anymore."
[/FONT][/FONT]
[/DIV]

soapbaox

soapbox wrote:
foolish to say that homeland security at all behaves like the national socialist era secret police.(gestapo).

[SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold"]No, it's not. The similarities are unmistakable.[/SPAN]


neither the policies or methods are the same and their is no comparison whatsoever.[/DIV][BR style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold"][SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold"]Horsecrap, plain and simple. Indefinite detention without being charged, snooping through your mail without a warrant, summary incarceration forever without being charged with anythng (except for those "secret" laws), governmental endorsement of torture....I don't see much of a difference.[/SPAN]

IT'S PRETTY OBVIOUS BY THE LANGUAGE USED IN YOUR RESPONSE THAT YOU ARE A YOUNG PERSON.[/DIV]IT IS ALSO OBVIOUS YOU LACK A FORMAL COLLEGE OR UNIVERSITY EDUCATION.[/DIV]YOU ALSO ASSUME I AM AN ADVOCATE OF THE PATRIOT ACT WITH THE POINTS I MADE.THAT IS A FAR LEAP.[/DIV]YOU ALSO ASSUME I AM A REPUBLICAN.THAT IS A FAR ASSUMPTION.

YOU WERE QUICK ON THJE TRIGGER AND BECAUSE OF THAT...YOUR ABILITY AT USING DEDUCTIVE LOGIC FAILED.

IT IS QUITE CLEAR MY POST IS ONLY ABOUT COMPARING THE NSDAP GOVERNMENT AND THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION.

THERE IS NO COMPARISON BETWEEN THE NAZI REGIME AND THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION.

PLEASE RESEARCH THE FUNDAMENTAL CHANGES HITLER HAD MADE TO GERMAN SOCIETY AS A RESULT OF OBTAINING POWER.CHANGES TO THE COURTS,LAW AND THE GERMAN CONSTITUTION.CHANGES MADE TO THE EDUCATION SYSTEM,LABOUR UNION SYSTEM,CHANGES MADE IN FOREIGN POLICY AND MILITARIZATION BEFORE YOU PULL OUT A COUPLE OF SIMPLISTIC POINTS AND SHOUT NAMES.

THE SHIFT IN GERMAN SOCIETY UNDER THE NAZIS IS NOWHERE NEAR THE CHANGES THAT HAVE BEEN MADE SINCE BUSH HAS COME TO POWER.

NOWHERE NEAR.
[/DIV]there are checks and balances within the united states and it's security apparatus.there is a seperation of judiciary and government.there are hundreds of other disimilarities.[/DIV]
[SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold"]You're stupid enough to believe anything, aren't you? What "checks and balances" exist when they can do the things mentioned above? I'll tel you: NONE. Now go back to worshipping George Bush, you f*cking fool.

[/SPAN] [/DIV]research the horrific realities of the NSDAP revolutionary government of that era and you will realize the ignorance with which you speak.

[SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold"]Research it yourself, dumbo.  All you have to do is look around and you'll see what a blind, sheep-like noncompoop you are. [/SPAN]
[/DIV]

TehBorken

soapbaox wrote: [div style="font-style: italic;"]neither the policies or methods are the same and their is no comparison whatsoever.[/div]
I think the similarities are obvious myself. Indefinite detention without being charged with anything sounds eerily familiar to me, maybe worse. At least the Nazis would cook up a phony charge to arrest you with.
The real trouble with reality is that there's no background music.

soapbox

indefinite arrest....under some very strict guidelines i might add.

that is the only comparison that you have made.

again,german society was radically changed as were ALL of it's institutions.that shift in the USA is nowhere near comparison.  

TehBorken

soapbox wrote:
indefinite arrest....under some very strict guidelines i might add.

Not strict enough. The "Patriot Act" is an insult to the constitution.


that is the only comparison that you have made.[/div][div] [/div]Dude, that's the only one I need to make.
[div]
The real trouble with reality is that there's no background music.